SBR in CT?

[Turbodreams]

Anyone know if these are allowed and how abouts to go through the procedures to have one if so?

[Mountain Man]

Sure are. I hyave my AR SBR'd. You need to file a Form 1, and do all the ATF paperwork,.

AR15.com has some good info, along with http://www.titleii.com/

A good gunshop, like NEX or JoJo's can also help walk you through the process.

[Turbodreams]

Thanks for the info.
Very helpful.

[Ripnrob]

Sure are. I hyave my AR SBR'd. You need to file a Form 1, and do all the ATF paperwork,.

AR15.com has some good info, along with http://www.titleii.com/

A good gunshop, like NEX or JoJo's can also help walk you through the process.

Moutain man maybe you could answer a question for me...In CT if you have a SBR stamp on your rifle can you then have the other so called evil features like folding or collapsable stocks or are you just limited to the short barrel...Thanks for any help

[Mountain Man]

Moutain man maybe you could answer a question for me...In CT if you have a SBR stamp on your rifle can you then have the other so called evil features like folding or collapsable stocks or are you just limited to the short barrel...Thanks for any help


If you have a Genuine Pre ban rifle ( Bushmaster, Eagle, etc), you can have the evil features.

The only thing the SBR Tax Stamp does is shorten the barrel. No way around it.

I was thinking about chopping my HK USC, and putting a can on it, but id be breaking the law, by adding a flash hiding device.

[Ripnrob]

If you have a Genuine Pre ban rifle ( Bushmaster, Eagle, etc), you can have the evil features.

The only thing the SBR Tax Stamp does is shorten the barrel. No way around it.

I was thinking about chopping my HK USC, and putting a can on it, but id be breaking the law, by adding a flash hiding device.


I understand...Thank you

[scottoe]

Mountain Man,

I would like to get a little more info on your response about not being able to use a can on a USC. CT doesn't allow a flash hider, but do allow a muzzle break. CT allows suppressors, so why wouldn't you be allowed to put one on a USC? Have you personally checked on this? My friend and I were debating this same subject recently, but neither of us looked into it.

Let me know your thoughts

Scottoe

[Mountain Man]

Ok, a USC is a post ban weapon. We have a Assault weapons ban in CT still. A Silencer is also a Flash hider. If you put a Can on a USC, you have added a evil feature, and now have a Illegal weapon in Ct.

This is sraight from my reputable dealer. He said if he had to testify in a court of law, the can is also a flash hider.

This isnt a issue in other states where the bans expired.

Any work with Cans and such I do on verifiable pre ban AR type rifles. I stick to Bushy and Eagle, or any company that is still around and can provide letters verifying build status. I have my letters, and keep them handy.

[MueveloNYC]

yo turbo, if you do get one let me know... I'll come over to play! :p

[scottoe]

Oh, they're allowed. folding stock has been CT legalized as well as removing the flash hider and installing a look a like muzzle brake (thanks to JFK on these boards)

going to the range for the first time this weekend!

http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/7258/img1685jj7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Turbodreams]

yo turbo, if you do get one let me know... I'll come over to play! :p

wont be for awhile, i was just asking so i know whether to save for one or not.

[HK4me]

Mountain Man- Kinda agree with Scottoe for cans, if its a "muzzle break" then its legal, if its a flash hider- thats illegal. Any more info would be appreciated.

[Mountain Man]

Mountain Man- Kinda agree with Scottoe for cans, if its a "muzzle break" then its legal, if its a flash hider- thats illegal. Any more info would be appreciated.


A can is a sound suppressor, and also a VERY effective flash hider. DEA tpes use them in meth lab raids, just in case.
I cant give you the legal jumbo, BUT... If you talk to somebody like JoJo's gunshop, and ask them about putting a can on a post ban rifle in CT, and ask about the flash hider bit, as I did, He told me he would testify that a can is a flash hiding devise.
Enough for me. Il stick to my pre bans.

[scottoe]

it's such a gray topic. If you ask any questions about firearms or related, the easiest thing anyone says is "no". Bottom line is nobody working for these agencies want to tell you that you can own something. DEA, ATF, DPS, on and on.

Answer me this....Why then does K5 have a bunch of supressors in lot of calibers for sale. They have a 308 can that you are allowed to put on a bolt action rifle or any other 308 for that matter. that is 100% legal, right. You can stick a can on the threaded end of a Accuracy International, why not a USC? And actually, the law states that you cannot have a threaded barrel to accept a flash hider. what if its not threaded, but is a quick detach style? Lots of grey. Lots of grey.

Scottoe

[Turbodreams]

As far as Ive been able to deduce with my readings of everything i can find when the brady bill was lifted all of that that went with it(i.e. all the accessories, hi-cap mags, flash hiders, suppressors all of it) became legal again. Hence why were able to have hi-cap mags on our pistols, that was one of the main parts of the brady bill. But we still have the 1986 AWB in affect you can go onto the DPS web page and see the list of rifles not allowed in this state.

[Mountain Man]

Answer me this....Why then does K5 have a bunch of supressors in lot of calibers for sale. They have a 308 can that you are allowed to put on a bolt action rifle or any other 308 for that matter. that is 100% legal, right. You can stick a can on the threaded end of a Accuracy International, why not a USC? And actually, the law states that you cannot have a threaded barrel to accept a flash hider. what if its not threaded, but is a quick detach style? Lots of grey. Lots of grey.

Scottoe

1.. Easy, Bolt actions rifle, as long as it doesnt have a detachable magazine, or Pistol grip, means you can add a flash hider, since it doesnt have the other evil features.

This can be a long drawn out argument. But simply, if it does seem gray, then do you really want to push it, and risk loosing everything ???

This is only CT im refering to. Other states you can do so much more.

[strojo]

Oh, they're allowed. folding stock has been CT legalized as well as removing the flash hider and installing a look a like muzzle brake (thanks to JFK on these boards)


When did the folding stock get legalized in CT?

[strojo]

This is sraight from my reputable dealer. He said if he had to testify in a court of law, the can is also a flash hider.


What dealer are you referring to?

[Mountain Man]

What dealer are you referring to?


JoJo's in Southington.

When I bought my USC, back when he was still in New Britain, I alked about threading and a can or such, and He told me because it was also a Flash hider, its a no no.

A can really does 3 things:

1. Obviously, Sound reduction
2. Flash hiding
3: Acts somewhat as a break, and promotes some aditon accuracy, by eliminating air-gas turbulance when the projectile exits the barrel.

[scottoe]

Strojo,

what I meant is I legalized the stock by making it a fixed stock, it doesn't fold. Sorry about the weird wording. A folding stock is still a no-no in CT.

Scottoe

[strojo]

Strojo,

what I meant is I legalized the stock by making it a fixed stock, it doesn't fold. Sorry about the weird wording. A folding stock is still a no-no in CT.

Scottoe

Gotcha. I was hoping I missed a law change. :)

What did you do to the stock to convert it to fixed? I'm looking at that type for my Bobcat.

[DINK]

I might as well throw my two cents in on this one. While I like and respect the boys at JoJo's, they don't have any sort of legal or LE background. While a can will act to reduce flash, it's purpose is to reduce noise. A longer barrel will reduce flash also, so does that mean everyone with a 20" barrel has an illegal rifle? I don't think so. Weaker ammo or ammo loaded with a flash-retardent powder will also reduce flash. Does that make full-power ammo a flash suppressor?

I'm not a lawyer and I don't even play one on TV, but I was a cop for 24 years and had to learn to interpret and use the state statutes that our beloved legislators have dumped on us. I usually find it difficult to muster up much sympathy for the state police that run the firearms unit, but the horrible mishmash that is our AWB is such a pile of crap that I can feel sorry for them having to try to enforce it. The whole headache of trying to figure out what an AK 47 "type" rifle is is a prime example.

When our liberal lawmakers first passed the CT AWB in 1994, there was only a list of firearms that were banned in the state. They were listed by specific make and model, except for the three times they threw the word "type" in and really screwed things up. Later, in 2001 or 2002, they added the wording from the Federal AWB as part of the definition of "Assault Weapon" in CT law. As long as the federal law was in effect, the CT law sort of rode it's coat tails and nobody really cared about it. Suddenly, it's 2004 and the federal law sunsets. Poof! It's gone! Suddenly the CT law has to stand on it's own and things get complicated because a lot of interpretation depended on BATF's definitions and administrative rulings and they no longer existed.

To the best of my knowledge, there is no statutory definition of "flash suppressor" in CT law, so we are floundering around without any real guidance in trying to figure out whether a can is a "flash suppressor" or not. The definition of "assault weapon" is of no help as it refers to rifles, as it just lists the "evil features", which include "A flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor..."

However, if we look at the next section of the statute (sec. (3)(B)), we get the definition of "assault Weapon" as it pertains to pistols. It reads as follows:

(B) A semiautomatic pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least two of the following:

(i) An ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip;

(ii) A threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip or silencer;

(iii) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the nontrigger hand without being burned;

(iv) A manufactured weight of fifty ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded; and

(v) A semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm...

Note that in this section of the law, our legislators listed "barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip or silencer" as four specific items. This would seem to indicate that they knew the difference between a flash suppressor and a noise suppressor and wrote the law to cover both of them. This isn't someone's interpretation or opinion- this is the law of the land, in black and white. In my experience, it's always best to refer to the actual statute when you're trying to figure out what is legal or not.

Based on this, it is my opinion that silencers can be used on postban semis in CT. This opinion is drawn from the actual statutes in CT and if someone can come up with a differing opinion that is also based on the statutes, I'd love to hear it. Unfortunately, the only opinion that would really matter is that of Attorney General Dick Blumenthal and being a veteran bureaucrat and long-time lawyer he won't give a clear-cut statement on anything unless he absolutely has to.

Anyway, discussing this is a good way to spend a snowy morning.

[compassman]

ATF deemed silencers flashiders. Connecticut follows suit based on the ATF ruling. Federal law over rides state law. Very simple there is no grey area. The ATF said it is a effective flashider then Connecticut will say the same. Remember the guy that got caught with a MAK90 which was completely legal in Connecticut. It was not a AK-47, there was no grey area. He was brought up on charges for not registering the rifle. The judge made a simple statement that changed everything and lead to the second gun registration in which I had to register my SAR-1 under the "AK-type" parts inter change. Here you go here is the statement made by the judge, "If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck then it must be a duck". Based on that simple statement we lost AK types in 7.62 forever. Now your in the hot seat with your silencer explaining to the prosecutor that the law is grey. A simple question will be asked. Does the silencer reduce muzzle flash mr.ATF agent. His reply "Yes, as a matter a fact our federal agency determined silencers to be flashiders". It walked and quacked like a duck. Purposely breaking the law just earned yourself a trip to the Connecticut state prison. All because you wanted the wow factor look what I got. The grey area will always lean to the states advantage. Even if you think it's right there is a good chance you will be fighting for not only your rights and property back, but a good chance you might be fighting for your freedom. Lots of money for a grey area.

[HK4me]

Not to beat a dead horse but why are silencers legal in CT? You can obtain a $200 tax stamp from ATF for a can here in CT. So, if ATF allows you to purchase a Tax stamp and they are the higher authority, then cans ARE LEGAL. Muzzle break vs flash hider is legal mumbo-jumbo. That may be a loophole that is being used.
The arguement that a can is a flash hider does NOT hold up for fake cans- like MP5 clones or LUSA which are legal in CT. Clones add legal length by adding a dummy can to conform to 16" barrel rule(clone may be SBR with fixed fake can).
Whenever ATF "inspects" an establishment, certain opinions become cold hard facts-which is where J---'s now interpretes cans as flash hiders.
This is a very interesting thread and I do not mean to disrespect anyone's opinion. I just am throwing my 2 cents in.

[compassman]

In CT you can put Suppressors on pistols no matter when they were made and you can put suppressors on pre-ban rifles and bolt actions. That is why there legal in CT. There is no muzzle break or flashider argument for these firearms.

You can't put a suppressor on a Post-Ban rifle in CT because it's a flashider.

Connecticut’s Assault Weapon Ban pre-dates the federal Assault weapon Ban.

Fake suppressors have nothing to do with anything. They are nothing, there not suppressors or muzzle breaks and need to be welded on to make the length legal. However, if you thread a post ban rifle then your breaking the law and need to weld or blind pin the fake suppressor.

No matter what you can't thread a post-ban rifle and you would need to permanently attach a silencer.

[scottoe]

Laws don't say anything about a 3-lug barrel. That is not technically a "threaded bbl", is it? I would sure like to be able to put a can on my SL8/G36C conversion. it's such a grey area, because technically, a long barrel hides the flash more than a shorter one. Does that mean long barrels are flash hiders too? I wish the people writing these provisions actually had any knowledge of firearms and the accessories. Although, thank god they kept the banning of a bayonet lug. We all know how often those are used in a crime.;0)

[compassman]

WRONG:

See the word "or" it does not matter if it's attached by a lug or not it's a flash hider. The law covers it's self simply by saying no flash hider "OR" a threaded barrel to accommodate. I don't care if you pin weld and duct tape a flash hider it's still a attached flash hider.

SEC 53-202A:
Part3

(iv) A flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; and

"this is what stops you from using a lug"

(v) A grenade launcher; or



(4) A part or combination of parts designed or intended to convert a firearm into an assault weapon, as defined in subdivision (3) of this subsection, or any combination of parts from which an assault weapon, as defined in subdivision (3) of this subsection, may be rapidly assembled if those parts are in the possession or under the control of the same person.


Read the part were it says "DESIGNED" a longer barrel was not designed as a flash hider. It's also not a add on part. Now if you designed a barrel to reduce flash then yes you would be in violation of the law, because the barrel was "DESIGNED" to reduce the flash.


The whole grey area for people is the Suppressor part. They insist it's a not a flash hider but under it's own design it reduced muzzle flash. During the Federal ban people assumed you could attach a suppressor. The ATF ruled that it's a flash hider. When your sitting in front of the judge after the CT state police and the ATF both assured the judge it is a flash hider the prosecutor will turn to you and ask "does the silencer hide the muzzle flash". Your answer will be short and quick, "yes it does sir".

[Mountain Man]

Thanks for backing me up on the " Can is a flash hider" discussion Compass.

[Turbodreams]

so what would I have to go through if i bought a pre-ban lower to SBR it with an HK 416 upper?

[infrared]

Are "fake" suppressors like the one pictured in this auction illegal in CT? http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=97014835

[compassman]

so what would I have to go through if i bought a pre-ban lower to SBR it with an HK 416 upper?


You can't buy a Pre-Ban lower in CT you would have had to own it before the Ban took affect. It's illigal for a dealer to transfer you a pre-ban lower after the ban. However if you own an assault rifle before the ban then you can SBR it.


Fake suppressor are nothing there not affected by nothing, except if they are used to make minimum length for a rifle then they have to be welded on to the barrel or if they attach by threads. Threads are a not legal on a Post-Ban rifle so the fake suppressor would have to be blind pinned or welded on, if you have a pre-ban rifle like a collapsible stock then you can add the fake suppressor with threads or a real one for that matter.

[2000ARMY]

You can't buy a Pre-Ban lower in CT you would have had to own it before the Ban took affect. It's illigal for a dealer to transfer you a pre-ban lower after the ban. However if you own an assault rifle before the ban then you can SBR it.


Fake suppressor are nothing there not affected by nothing, except if they are used to make minimum length for a rifle then they have to be welded on to the barrel or if they attach by threads. Threads are a not legal on a Post-Ban rifle so the fake suppressor would have to be blind pinned or welded on, if you have a pre-ban rifle like a collapsible stock then you can add the fake suppressor with threads or a real one for that matter.


This is wrong. You can buy a preban lower at any local gun shop that has one in stock (good luck finding one). chances are they will only sell it with an upper if they do have it and prepare to spend $375+ for it (just the lower). But you can also buy an preban lower from out of state (gunbroker. gunsamerica, etc) and have it transfered to your local FFL (again you will be paying big bucks). Just make sure it was manufactured before 9/13/04 and is not a COLT as they are banned by name in CT's AWB. Your FFL can then transfer it to you. You then are able to SBR it. Then go ahead and get that 416.

Compass can you please tell me where it says it is illegal to transfer a preban lower?

I am not trying to be a dick and I know I seem like i am coming off rude but you seem to not understand CT's AWB.

[Turbodreams]

You can't buy a Pre-Ban lower in CT you would have had to own it before the Ban took affect. It's illigal for a dealer to transfer you a pre-ban lower after the ban. However if you own an assault rifle before the ban then you can SBR it.


Fake suppressor are nothing there not affected by nothing, except if they are used to make minimum length for a rifle then they have to be welded on to the barrel or if they attach by threads. Threads are a not legal on a Post-Ban rifle so the fake suppressor would have to be blind pinned or welded on, if you have a pre-ban rifle like a collapsible stock then you can add the fake suppressor with threads or a real one for that matter.
See now I know youre full of ****. As I know a couple people who all bought preban lowers AFTER the ban.

[2000ARMY]

so what would I have to go through if i bought a pre-ban lower to SBR it with an HK 416 upper?


Start here ... http://ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=8&f=26&t=290819

There is a member on this board that can help you out and I think he might have some prebans in stock. I will get you his member name through PM.

[Turbodreams]

This is wrong. You can buy a preban lower at any local gun shop that has one in stock (good luck finding one). chances are they will only sell it with an upper if they do have it and prepare to spend $375+ for it (just the lower). But you can also buy an preban lower from out of state (gunbroker. gunsamerica, etc) and have it transfered to your local FFL (again you will be paying big bucks). Just make sure it was manufactured before 9/13/04 and is not a COLT as they are banned by name in CT's AWB. Your FFL can then transfer it to you. You then are able to SBR it. Then go ahead and get that 416.

Compass can you please tell me where it says it is illegal to transfer a preban lower?

I am not trying to be a dick and I know I seem like i am coming off rude but you seem to not understand CT's AWB.
Yea I knew its expensive for a pre-ban, I was actually chatting with a friend yesterday about his(which he got of of ar15.com from georgia i think it was) for $400. I was just more concerned with the amount of paperwork to SBR it and cost.

[2000ARMY]

Yea I knew its expensive for a pre-ban, I was actually chatting with a friend yesterday about his(which he got of of ar15.com from georgia i think it was) for $400. I was just more concerned with the amount of paperwork to SBR it and cost.


$200 tax stamp and Form 1 signed by your Police Chief unless you go through a Corporation / Trust.

[compassman]

Here is where there is a tiny loop hole that allows you to own pre-ban lowers but it can't be assembled as a pre-ban. You can by all the pre-ban lowers you want out of state but can't assemble them as a assualt weapon. Because you didn't own them before the ban.

Yes, you can buy a preban lower and bring it into CT, however it must be made in to a post ban rifle!!!! If you by a pre-ban lower bring into CT and put on all the evil features it becomes an assault weapon!!!!!! YOU DID NOT OWN THE ASSUALT WEAPON BEFORE THE BAN!!!! There is no sense in bringing in Pre-Ban lowers you can't build an "evil" rifle with all the goodies.


CT ASSUALT WEAPON: If you owned the stripped lower before the ban then you can do what ever you want. If you didn't own the stripped lower before the ban then you can't add the evil features. You did not own the assault weapon before the ban.



. 53-202c. Possession of assault weapon prohibited. Class D felony. (a) Except as provided in section 53-202e, any person who, within this state, possesses any assault weapon, except as provided in sections 29-37j, 53-202a to 53-202k, inclusive, and 53-202o and subsection (h) of section 53a-46a, shall be guilty of a class D felony and shall be sentenced to a term of imprisonment of which one year may not be suspended or reduced; except that a first-time violation of this subsection shall be a class A misdemeanor if (1) the person presents proof that he lawfully possessed the assault weapon prior to October 1, 1993, and (2) the person has otherwise possessed the firearm in compliance with subsection (d) of section 53-202d.



(b) The provisions of subsection (a) of this section shall not apply to the possession of assault weapons by members or employees of the Department of Public Safety, police departments, the Department of Correction or the military or naval forces of this state or of the United States for use in the discharge of their official duties; nor shall anything in sections 29-37j and 53-202a to 53-202k, inclusive, and subsection (h) of section 53a-46a prohibit the possession or use of assault weapons by sworn members of these agencies when on duty and the use is within the scope of their duties.



(c) The provisions of subsection (a) of this section shall not apply to the possession of an assault weapon by any person prior to July 1, 1994, if all of the following are applicable:



(1) The person is eligible under sections 29-37j and 53-202a to 53-202k, inclusive, and subsection (h) of section 53a-46a to apply for a certificate of possession for the assault weapon by July 1, 1994;



(2) The person lawfully possessed the assault weapon prior to October 1, 1993; and



(3) The person is otherwise in compliance with sections 29-37j and 53-202a to 53-202k, inclusive, and subsection (h) of section 53a-46a.



(d) The provisions of subsection (a) of this section shall not apply to a person who is the executor or administrator of an estate that includes an assault weapon for which a certificate of possession has been issued under section 53-202d, if the assault weapon is possessed at a place set forth in subdivision (1) of subsection (d) of section 53-202d or as authorized by the Probate Court.



(P.A. 93-306, S. 3; P.A. 02-120, S. 5.)

[2000ARMY]

You are impossible to talk to ..... Sec 53-202m says nothing about CT only. Please stop. You are confusing yourself and making up your own laws while doing so. you have changed your position on this topic 3 times today.



When did a lower become an assault weapon?


Again ...

Sec. 53-202m. Circumstances when assault weapons exempt from limitations on transfers and registration requirements. Notwithstanding any provision of the general statutes, sections 53-202a to 53-202l, inclusive, shall not be construed to limit the transfer or require the registration of an assault weapon as defined in subdivision (3) or (4) of subsection (a) of section 53-202a, provided such firearm was legally manufactured prior to September 13, 1994.



YOU DON'T NEED TO REGISTER SOMETHING THAT IS EXEMPT ....


IT DOES NOT SAY FIREARM THAT WAS IN CT PRIOR TO 9/13/94 IT SAYS MANUFACTURED PRIOR TO 9/13/94

[compassman]

It's this simple:

YOU BUY A "PRE-BAN" LOWER AND BUILD A ASSUALT WEAPON IN CT YOU’RE GOING TO JAIL.


I never said anything about registration something that is exempt! What the heck are you talking about?

A lower becomes an assault weapon when you make it into an assault weapon by adding evil features to it!

YOU ARE READING BETWEEN THE LINES AND PIECING WORDS TOGETHER! You are not reading the other statues that pertain to that statue. There are other statues before it that it is referring to!

[2000ARMY]

It's this simple:

YOU BUY A "PRE-BAN" LOWER AND BUILD A ASSUALT WEAPON IN CT YOU’RE GOING TO JAIL.


Ok....

like I said before .....

you go play with your neutered rifles

I'll have fun with my prebans and so will hundreds of other CT preban owners who know how to read statutes.


Here have a look ....

http://ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=8&f=26&t=290819

then go to a gun store and ask them.



What does notwithstanding mean? It means Despite .... lets put that word into the statute ...


Sec. 53-202m. Circumstances when assault weapons exempt from limitations on transfers and registration requirements. Notwithstanding / Despite any provision /stipulated condition of the general statutes, sections 53-202a to 53-202l, inclusive / including much or everything, shall not be construed / interpreted to limit the transfer or require the registration of an assault weapon as defined in subdivision (3) or (4) of subsection (a) of section 53-202a, provided such firearm was legally manufactured prior to September 13, 1994.

[compassman]

I'll have fun with my prebans and so will hundreds of other CT preban owners who know how to read statutes.


YES, I completely 1000% agree with you absolutely that pre-bans are ok and can have all the fun features. If you owned a Non-Colt before the assault weapon date you can do what ever you want. If you owned a Colt Ar15 before the ban and registered it you can do what ever you want.

If you read the last post I said If you buy a "pre-ban lower" (today) in CT take it home and build a rifle with all the goodies you are going to jail. You made a assault rifle and did not own the assault rifle before the ban.

CT does not care when the lower was made they care is if you bought it after the ban took place to turn it into a assault weapon. CT determines assault weapons by parts added to it. If you have the evil parts added to a rifle then you better have owned it before the ASSUALT WEAPON BAN. If a person comes to CT with a NON-Colt assault weapon then they have to remove the evil features to make it comply with the law.

If you bought a “Pre-Ban” lower today and transferred it in CT and build a assault rifle with all the goodies and a State Police question you on the assault weapon and asked if you can prove you owned the assault weapon before the assault weapon ban what would you say?

NO, Good by off to jail. This is my point!

[2000ARMY]

I'll have fun with my prebans and so will hundreds of other CT preban owners who know how to read statutes.


YES, I completely 1000% agree with you absolutely that pre-bans are ok and can have all the fun features. If you owned a Non-Colt before the assault weapon date you can do what ever you want. If you owned a Colt Ar15 before the ban and registered it you can do what ever you want.

If you read the last post I said If you buy a "pre-ban lower" (today) in CT take it home and build a rifle with all the goodies you are going to jail. You made a assault rifle and did not own the assault rifle before the ban.

CT does not care when the lower was made they care is if you bought it after the ban took place to turn it into a assault weapon. CT determines assault weapons by parts added to it. If you have the evil parts added to a rifle then you better have owned it before the ASSUALT WEAPON BAN. If a person comes to CT with a NON-Colt assault weapon then they have to remove the evil features to make it comply with the law.

If you bought a “Pre-Ban” lower today and transferred it in CT and build a assault rifle with all the goodies and a State Police question you on the assault weapon and asked if you can prove you owned the assault weapon before the assault weapon ban what would you say?

NO, Good by off to jail. This is my point!





Ok,

let me reiterate.

I wrote CT SLFU 5 months ago ....

told them

1. Im buying a stripped preban (PWA) AR15 lower not named colt
2. putting all the "fun" features on it including a silencer.


I was told I was good to go. I was covered under section 53-202m.


You have already said you are not a LEO or Lawyer so is it possible that you are wrong?



Answer me this...

Would reputable gun shops such as NGX or JoJo's sell a preban with the "fun" features on it if it was illegal.

If they sold it... according to you it would be a Felony.

Go there and look on the wall. There are a few.



This is my last post on this topic.


You are wrong and you are misleading people. I don't know what your agenda is.


If anyone has any questions on preban AR15's they should go to

http://ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=8&f=26&t=290819 and read.

[2000ARMY]

By the way talked to a Plainville Officer today while shooting my "illegal" rifle. 1 Sergeant and 2 officers agreed that it was legal.

One is very familiar with Nichols' Gun Store ..... He told me that never such thing happened where the father got in trouble for selling prebans or having prebans and the reason that the shop was closed was because the husband and wife got divorced.

So any more examples?

[Turbodreams]

I happened to be down in milford yesterday and stopped in at k-5. asked about the prebans, was told as long as the lower receiver(non colt) pre-dates the ban ANY accessories to it are legal.

[ctcsp846]

Weapons ban in CT is two fold. Some are banned by name, on a list of banned weapons. Some features are also banned (bayonet lugs, folding stocks etc.).

Preban rifles not named on the AWB List by name "AR15, Sporter" etc., are perfectly legal. If you buy a Preban Olympic/Bushmaster/Frankford/PWA, you can have all the Preban crap you want.

Banned by name weapons Thompsons/AK's/Ar's/Street Sweepers etc. are banned from anyone owning them if they did not own them before the ban. They can also not be transfered to another person in CT. Must be sold out of state.

So, in summary. Weapons banned by name cant be transfered except out of state. Prebans, but not named on the list, are fully transferable to anyone that can own them.

The only way to transfer a preban weapons that is named on the ban list is to be left the weapon in a will.

[H&K 4 LIFE]

...Banned by name weapons Thompsons/AK's/Ar's/Street Sweepers etc. are banned from anyone owning them if they did not own them before the ban. They can also not be transfered to another person in CT. Must be sold out of state...

Not entirely. CT allows for the ownership of Class III items. As long as they are not selective-fire capable or semi-auto they can be bought in CT. Full-auto only machine guns must be registered to the state, and all the usual ATF stuff applies. However, these guns can be of the same type as their banned semi-automatic cousins including the Thompson, UZI, and MAC-10.


I happened to be down in milford yesterday and stopped in at k-5. asked about the prebans, was told as long as the lower receiver(non colt) pre-dates the ban ANY accessories to it are legal.

Yes because the lower reciever is the only regulated part.

To posses a pre-ban lower you must have the proper certificate, which was only issued for a short time prior to the AWB. Also, these certificates along with the lowers are non-transferable items.

[infrared]

So how did this argument end...

If I buy a pre-ban lower - can I build an "evil rifle"?

Can I walk into a store and buy a pre-ban with all the evil stuff no problem in 2008?

Newington Gun Exchange had a preban Bushmaster that he said is for sale as long as its non-Colt and predates the ban... I should have pressed more deeply with the questions to get a clearer answer.

[infrared]

Hmm, ok - this was helpful: http://www.ar15.com/content/legal/preORpost.html

So I guess if I can prove the rifle was a "Semi Automatic Assault Rifle" before the ban, you should be able to buy one in CT as long as it's not a Colt.

What are some other cool pre-ban guns besides the AR-15 that is not named by name that are legal to own in CT?


Also, this raises another issue:

Lets say you buy a pre-ban that was assembled as a complete rifle before the ban:

A couple of scenarios:

After years of shooting, wear and tear, or neglect, etc - you need something like a new upper, barrel, whatever. So is it legal to replace that pre-ban barrel or upper assembly with a post-1994, like a brand new one, and still be able to maintain the "evil features"? The parts may be "new" 2008... but the lower is still pre-ban and the rifle was assembled as a "Semiauto Assault Weapon" prior to the ban date.... or simply, you have a 20" barrel and wish to make it into a 16" using a brand new replacement barrel.

Also, lets say you have a pre-ban that has a telescoping stock. For some reason you decide to change it out... because you dropped it and broke/bent it, or you decided you want to replace the telescoping stock with a folding stock... is that legal? Both features are "evil", but since it came with an "evil stock" prior to the ban - you should be allowed to put whatever kind of stock you want on it, correct?

And one final scenario: You buy a pre-ban that has a threaded barrel and a muzzle brake. You decide you want to remove that muzzle brake and install a can or a real flash hider. It had the "evil threaded barrel" prior to that... so you should be ok - right?

I guess the question is - can you add/remove/replace/repair the pre-ban parts with new post ban "evil parts" as long as the receiver is pre-ban and still have a legal rifle?

[2000ARMY]

yes if the AR-15 "lower" (non colt) was manufactured before 9/13/04 it is ok to put whatever you want on it.

you did not need to own it prior to 1994. and it did not need to be in CT before 1994. You could buy a preban lower (non-Colt) from someone in Georgia tommorow and still put all of the evil features on it.

As long as the lower(part w/serial #) is not replaced everything else can be. Most people who buy preban lowers buy them stripped. This way they can build it any way they want.

Here is a pic of mine ...started off as a stripped lower in the beginning of the year. Complete w/ my new silencer.


http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v428/2000ARMY/AR15%20and%20Silencer/?action=view&current=IMG_0501.jpg

[infrared]

Nice rifle 2000ARMY

This is the statue that covers pre-1994. It does not really say specifically it has to be a complete, functioning firearm as the AR15 link I posted earlier.

It says "provided such firearm was legally manufactured"... since the lower is the only regulated item, that is considered the "firearm"... and as such, you should be covered in building an "evil rifle"...

Sec. 53-202m. Circumstances when assault weapons exempt from limitations on transfers and registration requirements. Notwithstanding any provision of the general statutes, sections 53-202a to 53-202l, inclusive, shall not be construed to limit the transfer or require the registration of an assault weapon as defined in subdivision (3) or (4) of subsection (a) of section 53-202a, provided such firearm was legally manufactured prior to September 13, 1994.

[2000ARMY]

I would also like to clarify .... you do not need to have a certificate for an ar-15 preban lower. please see my post above

[H&K 4 LIFE]

Well, mine is a Colt (w/ AWB cetificate) so I guess thats where the confusion came from. :p

[2000ARMY]

Lucky :mad: