Barrel Still Dirty

[reaper8154]

I put 100 rounds of WWB and 50 rounds of HST +P through my HK45 today and all went great. I got it home and cleaned it up and could not get all of the fouling out of the barrel. I can see some on the rifling and no matter how long I scrubbed it would not come all of the way off. I got most of it with a copper brush, CLP and patches, but there is still a little left and its driving me crazy. I've cleaned a lot of guns before, including my HK45 and have NEVER run into this before. Any suggestions?

[Rican Havoc]

Breakfree CLP is my favorite All-In-One solution, but it does very little to remove heavy copper fouling and some of the more resilient powder residue.

Try a product specifically made to be a solvent, such as Hoppes #9, or my favorite, the odorless Gunslick Copper Klenz.

[JimK66]

That has to drive you nuts: I'm going to the range in the morning with my new HK45c and will be firing Winchecter 230gr FMJ's from WM. I anxious to see how this polygonal rifling works out as well.
I've used BreakFree CLP and Hoppies for years and swear by it. You might want to consider using a boresnake along with your brush.
Let us know how things work out.
JimK

[Kenji]

I am anal about getting the barrel very clean. This is why I usually spend 1-1.5 hours per gun cleaning them.

I take a patch and wrap it around a phosphor bronze brush. I then soak this with solvent, and run it through the barrel 20-30 times. The patch helps absorb the dirt.

Then I run wet patches through the barrel until they come out clean.

Then I repeat the above procedure as many times as needed, usually 2-4, until the inside of the barrel is spotless.

I do this every time I come back from the range.

The longer you wait after shooting to clean it, the harder it is to get out.

Good Luck!

[shoot4life]

The longer you wait after shooting to clean it, the harder it is to get out.



+10

If you take your barrel cleaning kit to the range with you, and clean your barrel while it is still hot, but cool enough to handle with your bare hands, it is much easier to clean, and whatever bore cleaner you use is that much more effective.

Shooters Choice MC7 is what I prefer, but do not let that contact the polymer frame.

Benchresters and Varminters clean their match grade rifle barrels while they are still warm, as it is easier and more effective.

Cheers Brother

[jboro76]

Hoppes makes a product called Benchrest, it's a copper solvent. Follow the directions on the bottle.

It works.

[tool1075]

let solvent soak in the barrel for a while....

solvents do the work, so you don't have to. (sounds like a commercial, but it's true)

MPRO-7 works well. Hoppes elite is the same exact product, if you want to get some at walmart really quick....

[JessR45]

Hi,

In cleaning tough barrel crud (only happens in my .45 acp pistols), I use a product called Big 45 Frontier Metal Cleaner. Works all the time in no time at all, and does not scratch or mar the barrel. Try it, you might like it...

Thanks,
Jess

[RyanH&K21EOwner]

I soak the barrel for an hour with Hopp's and blow out with break free...

I use a hand drill with pre-fab cleaning bits at medium speed to clean the barrel L & G...

The barrel will come out 100 % clean with a nice bore...

[GPD45]

I use a bore snake. It works great!!

GPD45

[Sobriquet]

+1 on the boresnake. Use a .410 shotgun one because the fabric part will be longer and will require fewer passes. I actually posted a thread yesterday because I was concerned if it was too rough on the barrel given how fast it was at getting the thing clean.

I take a few paper towels, fold them into a small square, and put the muzzle end of the barrel on it. Then I take a can of Breakfree CLP and spray inside until it foams up out top a little. You let it sit for a few minutes standing up, pick it up, and let the liquid run out the bottom onto the paper towels. Then I run the boresnake through 3 times and it's good as new. I scrub the feeding ramp with a bit of paper towel moistened with the BreakFree.

I find paper towels to be easier than using patches. I only use the patches for applying a thin layer of CLP to surfaces to protect and lube them before reassembly.

[Kost]

When I first start cleaning the weapon, I run the brass bore brush thru the barrel a few times, then let it sit with the solvent in the bore and clean the rest of the weapon. After cleaning everything I go back to the barrel again with some clean solvent and a few more passes with the brass bore brush, and the bore looks like a mirror when done. I really dont spend much time on the barrel - the 45 minute 'soak' while Im cleaning the rest of the parts, seems to really do the work - so I dont have to. :)

[softmentor]

Dittos with the sugestions above. For stuborn bits like the one you have or for any lead fowling I also use Big 45 Frontier Metal Cleaner, as suggested by JessR45. Love the stuff so much I gave some to a couple of my shooting buddies who now swear by it too.
http://www.big45metalcleaner.com/

[reaper8154]

Thanks fellas. This is making my OCD really flare up. I am soooo anal about my weapons and clean them every time I shoot them. I had to put a coyote down one night at work with my G22. It took 1 shot and to me warranted a 45 minute cleaning when I got home.

I have just never seen fouling that is this stubborn. I guess I will have to go get some of the products you guys suggested, since my beloved CLP can't do the job.

And I have a boresnake for my AR and one for my 12 ga. They are great, just haven't got around to getting them for my pistols. Thanks for the advice on the .410 boresnake for my 45.

I think you guys just saved me from having a melt down! :92:

[Cadillac Johnson]

The strongest solvent I've used is Barnes CR-10.

It's noticably stronger than Sweets if that gives you an idea.

It does have a VERY strong odor though.

If you're looking for a quick fix, household ammonia will clean it out quickly.

Just be sure to clean the ammonia off and lube it back up thouroughly.

If you dont have any ammonia around the house, let it sit in whatever CLP you have overnight and run a brush through it.

[ulose2]

I am anal about getting the barrel very clean. This is why I usually spend 1-1.5 hours per gun cleaning them.

I take a patch and wrap it around a phosphor bronze brush. I then soak this with solvent, and run it through the barrel 20-30 times. The patch helps absorb the dirt.

Then I run wet patches through the barrel until they come out clean.

Then I repeat the above procedure as many times as needed, usually 2-4, until the inside of the barrel is spotless.

I do this every time I come back from the range.

The longer you wait after shooting to clean it, the harder it is to get out.

Good Luck!+1, I utilize same technique also with Break-free CLP. If copper is prevelant use a copper solvent, then finish with the CLP. It has worked for yrs with rifles and pistols..

[notorious_HK]

I had a similar experience to the OP, and tried many suggestions. So far, I have found the quickest way to clean up the barrel is to use the 'Remington 40-X Bore Cleaner'.
If you read the directions right, you apply Rem-Oil soaked patches through the bore first, then run patches of the 40-X. Go back to Rem-Oil patches, then dry patches.
I then follow up with Militec-1 oil (not the grease) to get rid of any remaining fouling, and protect the bore (I run a dry patch through the bore before I head out to the range).

I haven't tried any of the MPro products yet, but have heard good things.
This is using the Otis cleaning kit, wrapping the patches over the bore brush.
This may sound like a lot of work, but in practice it has made cleaning less of a chore.

P.S. - For copper stuff, I finally settled on Wipe Out foaming cleaner - it works.

[denslen]

Bore snake. FP-10.
I've noticed the same thing with my HK45 after shooting monarch ammo. I just figured it was dirty ammo and the barrel had not been "broken in" yet with FP-10 or militec. may try "weapon shield" next when my stash runs out.

cheers
Derek

[MaD HuNGaRIaN]

Use Sweet's 7.62.
It has a lot of ammonia.
Do not leave it in the barrel for longer than 20 minutes!

Will be squeaky clean after.

[Slingblade2006]

You clean your guns?!? I clean my barrel with more ammo.

[Scooter]

Man, you guys are crazy. When I do clean my gun, a once a year thing, it takes me 30 minutes max and that is doing a detail strip.

I take it you haven't read Schuemann Barrels thoughts on cleaning.

[hwjohn]

I take it you haven't read Schuemann Barrels thoughts on cleaning.

Link? I'd like to read it. I hope it says (authoritatively) that you can shoot it forever and never clean it:)

[NiceHK]

I have heard that if you consistently use weapon shield it will aid in protecting against wear but also aid in cleaning. As the product creates a bonded coating over the metal surfaces the deposits fall onto the coating and when cleaning its easier to get the debris off the coated surface rather than the metal itself. I will be switching to this product upon my first HK purchase. Give the product a look as their site provides rich material to make for an interesting read.

[Scooter]

http://www.schuemann.com/Content/clean0.htm

[hwjohn]

http://www.schuemann.com/Content/clean0.htm

Thanks Scooter. Amazing how wide the opinions on cleaning range.

[NiceHK]

Real good info Scooter. Thanks.

[Horseman]

Does anyone know if Schuemann feels the same way about the newer cleaners such as Weapon Shield or Eezox?

[denslen]

I believe weapon shield was developed by the guy that developed FP-10. same thing-if you consistently use the same thing to clean and lube your weapon will never be degreased. Break free, militec and fp-10 all claim the same thing.
with a HK there is probably little difference between using fp-10, break free, weapon shield or even ballistol.
cheers
Derek

[Sobriquet]

I have heard that if you consistently use weapon shield it will aid in protecting against wear but also aid in cleaning. As the product creates a bonded coating over the metal surfaces the deposits fall onto the coating and when cleaning its easier to get the debris off the coated surface rather than the metal itself. I will be switching to this product upon my first HK purchase. Give the product a look as their site provides rich material to make for an interesting read.

I'll let you know. I have two bottles of Weapon Shield in the mail to me right now.

[NiceHK]

I'll let you know. I have two bottles of Weapon Shield in the mail to me right now.

I know at least a few members on this board recommend it. Also the Lithi Shield caught my eye. It perked my interest when they state "It is ideal for all heavy machine gun and artillery usages". It must be just right for the heavy action of a HK pistols slide rails.

[reaper8154]

Well, I used some Hoppe's No.9 (it was cheap) and some more Breakfree tonight and got rid of most of the fouling. I can still see alittle, but I feel better. I cleaned my X300 again too. It gets filthy after 200 rounds or so.

I am moving at the first of May, so I haven't had alot of time to shoot. I'm thinking my barrel isn't broken in all of the way yet. I do find that shooting is a good way to relieve the stress of moving tho. :83:

[Cadillac Johnson]

I've been using Weapon Shield for a while now and love it.

I think it's the best CLP available.

I have a tub of Lithi Shield that I've used before, and it's good stuff. I like using grease on the rails and barrel of my Sigs. I use Amsoil grease, and sometimes Mobil 1 grease for the most part now, but I'd have no problem using Lithi Shield again.

[NiceHK]

I've been using Weapon Shield for a while now and love it.

I think it's the best CLP available.

I have a tub of Lithi Shield that I've used before, and it's good stuff. I like using grease on the rails and barrel of my Sigs. I use Amsoil grease, and sometimes Mobil 1 grease for the most part now, but I'd have no problem using Lithi Shield again.


Good to hear. Have you noticed a help in preventing wear? Why did you stop using the Lithi Shield in favor for the others? When cleaning do you use anything else besides Weapon Shield? Do you run a damp patch through the barrel to give it a light internal coat? In their tech. doc's they explain that it improves the bullets trajectory since the barrel becomes smother I believe.

[Sobriquet]

My Weapon Shield CLP showed up today. I won't be able to get to the range for at least another week, but I'll let you know if it made a difference.

[Cadillac Johnson]

Good to hear. Have you noticed a help in preventing wear? Why did you stop using the Lithi Shield in favor for the others? When cleaning do you use anything else besides Weapon Shield? Do you run a damp patch through the barrel to give it a light internal coat? In their tech. doc's they explain that it improves the bullets trajectory since the barrel becomes smother I believe.

As far as I can tell it pretty much stopped the wear. Now all of my guns are pretty well broken in so they were all beyond the initial polishing phase. However there are no smiley's on the barrels that weren't there already since I started using it. Take that FWIW.

Lithi Shield is good stuff like I said, but in general I prefer synthetic based lubricants. Amsoil and Mobil 1 greases are both synthetic based. Amsoil has EP/AW additives like Lithi Shield and I can get it locally. They dont seem to have any problems mixing with the Weapon Shield. I had gotten the Lithi Shield just in case they had a problem getting along.

Cleaning is really easy. I just take a dry patch and everything wipes clean, and then run a wet patch over it again. I do use Hoppes #9 once in a while on the bore, and ProShot copper remover when it needs it. That's pretty rare though as Weapon Shield does a great job of cleaning. Better than any other CLP I've used as a matter of fact.

When the bore is clean I run a wet patch through it and then follow it up with a dry patch. I use Weapon Shield on all the non-contact points, and then grease on the rails and outside of the barrel with Weapon Shield as a floater.

Sigs and HK's are about as accurate as combat style pistols get so I cant say I've noticed any change in accuracy. If there was a difference, I'm not a good enough shot to tell.

[NiceHK]

My Weapon Shield CLP showed up today. I won't be able to get to the range for at least another week, but I'll let you know if it made a difference.

Look forward to it. I bet it will take a bit of time to report back on its protective properties. It will also be interesting to see if it is easier to clean your pistol after consistently using the product.

[NiceHK]

As far as I can tell it pretty much stopped the wear. Now all of my guns are pretty well broken in so they were all beyond the initial polishing phase. However there are no smiley's on the barrels that weren't there already since I started using it. Take that FWIW.

Lithi Shield is good stuff like I said, but in general I prefer synthetic based lubricants. Amsoil and Mobil 1 greases are both synthetic based. Amsoil has EP/AW additives like Lithi Shield and I can get it locally. They dont seem to have any problems mixing with the Weapon Shield. I had gotten the Lithi Shield just in case they had a problem getting along.

Cleaning is really easy. I just take a dry patch and everything wipes clean, and then run a wet patch over it again. I do use Hoppes #9 once in a while on the bore, and ProShot copper remover when it needs it. That's pretty rare though as Weapon Shield does a great job of cleaning. Better than any other CLP I've used as a matter of fact.

When the bore is clean I run a wet patch through it and then follow it up with a dry patch. I use Weapon Shield on all the non-contact points, and then grease on the rails and outside of the barrel with Weapon Shield as a floater.

Sigs and HK's are about as accurate as combat style pistols get so I cant say I've noticed any change in accuracy. If there was a difference, I'm not a good enough shot to tell.

What about solvents? DO you feel you are able to get away from them once you start coating parts with weapon shield since it’s easier to get residue off of the protected surfaces? I used solvents like gun wash to spray through hard to reach area’s like the trigger assembly. This is excluding a bore cleaner that you occasionally use.

[Cadillac Johnson]

Solvents aren't necessary with Weapon Shield on any areas other than the bore occasionally.

I am pretty anal about cleaning my guns though and I take a wet patch of Hoppes over everything when I do a detail strip. It's probly not necessary, but it doesn't hurt either. Everything gets a thin coat of Weapon Shield to follow up after the Hoppes.

Outside of the barrel, and maybe the extractor, everything wipes clean with a dry patch.

Plus it smells like cinnimon! How can you go wrong?

[SIGtrarian]

You clean your guns?!? I clean my barrel with more ammo.Exactly! Fire the round. The bullet travelling down the barrel pushes out anything in front if it, but leaving a trail of fouling and a very thin, protective copper coating behind it. To clean that out, fire another round and repeat.

[Sobriquet]

Exactly! Fire the round. The bullet travelling down the barrel pushes out anything in front if it, but leaving a trail of fouling and a very thin, protective copper coating behind it. To clean that out, fire another round and repeat.

You never clean your guns? Period?

[SIGtrarian]

You never clean your guns? Period?After every trip to the range I hose out the reciever with aerosol Break Free, let it soak awhile, repeat, blow it out with compressed air, then lube accordingly. The barrel, I soak a patch with Break Free and swab out the bore, then run dry patches until they come out fairly clean. Then I put a drop of oil on a patch and run that through the bore, leaving an extremely thin coating. For oil I mix 50/50 Break free and Mobil One. I never use lead bullets or a brush in the bore. After many thousands of rounds, all my barrels look pristine, with no harsh cleaning. My previous post was only half serious.

[Sobriquet]

My mistake. I missed the sarcasm.

[NiceHK]

Solvents aren't necessary with Weapon Shield on any areas other than the bore occasionally.

I am pretty anal about cleaning my guns though and I take a wet patch of Hoppes over everything when I do a detail strip. It's probly not necessary, but it doesn't hurt either. Everything gets a thin coat of Weapon Shield to follow up after the Hoppes.

Outside of the barrel, and maybe the extractor, everything wipes clean with a dry patch.

Plus it smells like cinnimon! How can you go wrong?

You for sure can't go wrong. Good info btw. At what intervals do you perform a detail strip? Does the manual state a rule of thumb?

[Cadillac Johnson]

You for sure can't go wrong. Good info btw. At what intervals do you perform a detail strip? Does the manual state a rule of thumb?

Eh, just kind of when they need it.

Maybe every 1000rds or so. Probly sooner if I've been shooting a lot of WWB, maybe longer if it's been Speer Lawman.

You may notice the trigger is a touch smoother as well. After switching to Weapon Shield I could tell a small improvement. That was after using Slip2000, which is really good stuff as well, if that gives you an idea how highly I think of Weapon Shield.

[Sobriquet]

How do you detail strip the HK45? Is it safe for a novice to do? Is it necessary?

[NiceHK]

You may notice the trigger is a touch smoother as well. After switching to Weapon Shield I could tell a small improvement. That was after using Slip2000, which is really good stuff as well, if that gives you an idea how highly I think of Weapon Shield.

Interesting observation. I see this as a nice plus.

[NiceHK]

How do you detail strip the HK45? Is it safe for a novice to do? Is it necessary?

I would be interested in seeing a pic of a detail striped hk45 or p30 just to see to what extent a detail strip is defined.

[SIGtrarian]

My mistake. I missed the sarcasm.I was only being partially sarcastic. I've never had a problem in 35 years with my 'minimalist' approach to bore cleaning. After reading some of the harsh methods some people use, I stopped buying used guns. Unless lead bullets are used, there is never going to be much of a residue build up, no more than a micron or two of protective coating.