Shots goin downwards

[sterls18]

Hi all,
I been to the range twice since I got my Hk uspc .40 its used it had only 40 shots out of it so It should be in good condition and my shots keeping going downwards some shots will get close to my target but most will hit the stomach if I am aiming for the chest. iI it me that I can not shot good or the gun need adjusting. I mean my targets are about 15-20 feet maybe 25 feet that I have my targets not to far so I should be hitting close to the chest but the shots keep droping lower in the stomach or if I AIM for the head I will hit the chest. Please please help me maybe its me and not the gun or could it be that something is wrong with the gun and needs fixing
Thanks
Sterls18

[AviatorDave]

At 15-20 feet, you should be able to hit the chest without even using the sights at all.

Have you tried putting it on a rest when shooting?

What do the sights look like when you shoot?

[NightFighter]

Take a friend to the range with you and have him load one or two dummy rounds in your magazine and load your pistol for you. I bet that you will be caught flinching down in anticipation of recoil when the you pull the trigger on the dummy round.

This is also a great way to practice tap and rack failure drills. Tap the bottom of the magazine to make sure it is seated and then rack the slide quickly to clear the malfunction.

[Andre]

Patient, you must be, young Skywalker. Control of the trigger, with practice it comes.

[The_Crow]

Patient, you must be, young Skywalker. Control of the trigger, with practice it comes.

:) LMAOL! I think my coffee came out my nose when I read that.

[Andre]

I aim to please...

[rohardi]

"aim to please" LMAO I'm dying over here!!!!!!

[DuceAnAHalf]

i was having a problem pulling the rounds low and a little left. what i was doing was pulling the trigger with the first joint of my finger, i moved to using the tip of my finger and the rounds started going right on target

[Sobriquet]

I couldn't resist.

http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk131/Sobriquet47/Yoda_mp5k.jpg

[detroit25]

I couldn't resist.

http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk131/Sobriquet47/Yoda_mp5k.jpg


This is GREAT! I just found my new desktop.

[H&K 4 LIFE]

You are pulling the gun downward in anticipation of recoil.

[HKCHEF]

This sums it up

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg106/Sukimasterchef/shooterswheel.jpg

[hardcalibres]

There are some other possibilities that have not been considered to explain his shots going low:

1) What type of ammo he is using - if his projectiles are about 500-700 grain and going about 250 fps at the muzzle then this would explain it - but the projectiles may be longer than the maximum OAL for 40S&W which would mean he is single loading them and possibly even dismantling the gun to insert each round in the chamber.

2) He shoots at a gun range located several thousand feet below sea level where the gravity is more intense.

Regards

Hardcalibres

[Yon]

I had a similar problem when I started shooting a few months ago. I had to get used to the P30 Double Action/Single Action feel. My problem was jerking the trigger in anticipation of the shot. When the hammer is cocked, try to pull the trigger back easy till you feel a slight resistance. Then re-align your sights to make sure you're aiming at the target, then with a quick movement, squeeze the trigger the rest of the way which should reduce the movement of the trigger if you had to squeeze it from the starting position.

I'm not a professional, but it seems to work for me and I've gotten alot better groupings since doing that.

[Wade]

I had this problem too. I thought it was me. Turns out a previous owner had installed nightsights for the full sized USP on my compact USP. I put the proper sights on and I am back in the bull. HK sights are also set for the front dot to cover the POI.

[Kost]

Basics of shooting, the gun is going to go BANG and move in various directions - get used to it, thats just what guns do...put it out of your mind and concentrate on: Trigger, Sights, Grip - do your part, and let the gun do 'its thing'.

Do your part well, and the gun will/should do its part well.

[walker77]

Ive been told that european guns are designed for the front site to cover your point of impact. American guns are designed to put the top tip of your sight on your point of impact. Dont know if this is really true or not, but i had the same problem. I called hk and ordered a smaller front sight. They are cheap, i want to say they were around 10 dollars give or take. But this took care of my problem. If you have night sights, you cant get lower or higher front sights. Hopes this helps.

[Sierra07]

Had a similar issue when i first got my uspc .40. Good advice i got was to use the pad of my trigger finger, not the joint to shoot. Now i've put through 300 rounds and my grouping looks sooo much better. Just practice and don't anticipate the bang. ^_^'

[mtpisgah]

I have found that if I fire slowly and concentrate too much, I pull low and left. If I just blow through the magazine, I hit dead on. I am anticipating the recoil when I go slow. I have tried snap caps but they haven't helped much yet. I just keep going to the range and trying.

[warISpeace]

...
2) He shoots at a gun range located several thousand feet below sea level where the gravity is more intense.

Regards

Hardcalibres

I don't mean to get off topic but this brings up a good question: If you could drill a hole all the way through the center of the earth to the opposite side and drop a ball would it oscilate between poles forever (sans all friction) or slowly loose speed and come to a floating rest in the middle? I have thought about this question for years and still do not know the answer.

Back to the bullet being shot thousands of feet below sea level:
If gravity is constant then the force on the bullet equals the same at sea level.

One last thought: Since the bullet occupies space it too has its own gravitational attraction. So as the bullet falls to the ground, the ground also "falls" to the bullet; however, the bullet's gravitational field is extremely weak and its gravitational effect on the earth cannot be measured with current technology ;)

[Scooter]

Back to the bullet being shot thousands of feet below sea level:
If gravity is constant then the force on the bullet equals the same at sea level.

Gravity isn't constant. F=GMm/R^2 Gravity changes depending on the distance apart from the two objects.

[hardcalibres]

Indeed and the analogy of the hole drilled through the earth is quite different to a naturally low area of the earths surface.

For example, the earth is not a sphere and is in fact flat at the poles (ie shorter radius at the poles than at the equator - an oblate spheroid.

Gravity isn't constant. F=GMm/R^2 Gravity changes depending on the distance apart from the two objects.

Consequently the force of gravity is more intense at the poles than the equator. This fact combined with (the more significant) lower temperature and more dense air in polar regions actually changes bullet performance enough to require correction by snipers.

Regards

Hardcalibres

[ulose2]

I thought for a minute, I was back in college.for a science essay....Remember BRASS...Breath, Relax, Aim,Squeeze, Shoot

[AviatorDave]

I don't mean to get off topic but this brings up a good question: If you could drill a hole all the way through the center of the earth to the opposite side and drop a ball would it oscilate between poles forever (sans all friction) or slowly loose speed and come to a floating rest in the middle? I have thought about this question for years and still do not know the answer.

It would melt and become part of the center. If the core wasn't molten, it would just stop in the center. Gravity is an attraction of mass, so equilibrium would be when it would have an equal force pulling on it from all directions, as would be in the center.

Back to the bullet being shot thousands of feet below sea level:
If gravity is constant then the force on the bullet equals the same at sea level.

Gravity is not constant. Not even on the surface of the earth. Gravity, again, is an attraction of mass as a function of the distance apart. Several thousand miles under the earth's crust, the planet is much more dense than at the surface, so gravity is stronger, like 10.7 m/s2 instead of the average 9.8m/s2 on the surface. And not even in orbit are you free from gravity. Orbit is the act of falling, you just keep missing the earth. With no gravity, there would be no orbit.

One last thought: Since the bullet occupies space it too has its own gravitational attraction. So as the bullet falls to the ground, the ground also "falls" to the bullet; however, the bullet's gravitational field is extremely weak and its gravitational effect on the earth cannot be measured with current technology ;)

Maybe not measured, but it can be calculated. F=(Gmm)/DxD.

[hardcalibres]

Gravity is not constant. Not even on the surface of the earth.

Indeed. Gravimetric surveys of the earths surface are used as a mineral exploration tool to identify the presence of subsurface gravity "anomalies" which are associated with (more dense) mineral deposits. These instruments can be airborne, vehicle mounted or even in a backpack.

The data from these surveys are used (with other geophysical measurements: radiometric, Induced Potential etc) to determine good prospects for drilling.

Regards

Hardcalibres

[Alan_13]

Okay I havent been part of this thread nor have i even been keeping up with it, but I figured Id take a look.... and OMG!?!?!?! I am completly lost! maybe I should have gone to college... or at least payed attention in HS:confused:

[G3Kurz]

Sterls18

You must learn trigger control and patience behind the weapon. It is not the handgun. You are disturbing the sight alignment at the last minute with bad trigger squeeze, anticipation of the shot and/or looking at the target over the sights. Practice dry firing the pistol (w/o it loaded) until you can gently drop the hammer w/o disturbing the alignment of the sights. PROPER trigger control is a constant never stopping application of pressure straight to the rear on the trigger at the same constant speed (no stopping and restarting or speeding up) w/o squeezing the rest of the hand at the same time. It is THE MOST IMPORTANT aspect of shooting. Even with perfect sight alignment poor trigger control ruins everything. Good trigger control with imperfect sight alignment will still get you hits.

ALL of your focus goes on the front sight (NOT THE TARGET!) to keep the sights properly aligned while you press the trigger straight to the rear. Your secondary vision (also called peripheral vision) will insure your sights stay on target while you focus only on the front sight. Forget about the movement you see of the sights around and off the target. That is an optical illusion caused by the distance from your sights to the target. If you hold your muzzle up against the target that shows the real movement of the pistol downrange (1/4 - 1/2” max.).

The trick then is to “launch” the round by squeezing the trigger w/o misaligning the sights. That will send all rounds downrange within a “tube” which represents the actual capabilities of the ammo, pistol, shooter combo.

Once you can do it right in dry firing do the same thing with live ammo. Your groups should tighten and the "flyers" disappear.

Good luck. GOOD practice makes perfect. As a challenge have a friend balance a dime on your front sight. If you can drop the hammer w/o knocking the dime off you are ready for the range.

G3Kurz

[rohardi]

If a tree falls in the woods and no one is around to hear it, does it make a noise?????

[warISpeace]

lol! This was a good exercize for my brain.

[hardcalibres]

Good luck. GOOD practice makes perfect. As a challenge have a friend balance a dime on your front sight. If you can drop the hammer w/o knocking the dime off you are ready for the range.

And when you can snatch the pebble from my hand Grasshopper, it will be time for you to leave....

And there is only do or not do - there is no try......

No seriously though, G3K is right; while some people avoid dry firing, any damage it may do (which is another subject for debate) is more than out weighed by the improvement in technique that you get.

Regards

Hardcalibres

[CrippledPidgeon]

Once you can do it right in dry firing do the same thing with live ammo. Your groups should tighten and the "flyers" disappear.

One of the pieces of advice that's given a lot, and I've used to work out my flinching is to take live ammo, mix in snap caps, and then load up mags. I try to not look at what I'm doing during this process, and then shuffle up the mags so that the snap caps are thoroughly randomized.

Shoot as normal and watch what happens when the snap cap is loaded rather than the live round. You're not expecting it to happen, and your normal flinches and bad habits will suddenly show up and you'll be like, "frak."

[AviatorDave]

The whole "dime on the front sight" doesn't do jack for me. I can put one on the front of my crappy Ruger P85 and dry fire it as many times as I want without the dime falling off. Maybe the front sight is just too wide for it to be an effective exercise, I don't know.

I used a different technique to get over flinching when I first started shooting - instead of the "let the boom surprise you" which to me CAUSES flinching, I practiced until I ENJOYED the recoil and the boom. If I know when it's going to go boom, which I will once you've shot a particular trigger enough, there's no surprise and no flinch. I had a unique situation with a grandfather with a bunch of land in east Texas. We'd put cans and bottles on a fallen tree trunk and practice shooting them as quickly as possible.

Even my PSG1 trigger doesn't ever "surprise" me. There's the tiniest bit of resistance almost at the release. Once I hit that, I know that any further pressure will make it fire. My handguns are the same way - I know exactly where the trigger will break, and pull it back that far, then steady the sights, then squeeze the last little bit until it fires.

There is one trigger, however, that does surprise me every time almost - my G3 set trigger. In the set mode, there's no creep, no pre-travel, none of that. Any pressure at all and the hammer drops, there's no perceived travel at all, only pressure is required.

[amstaffHK]

Hi all,
I been to the range twice since I got my Hk uspc .40 its used it had only 40 shots out of it so It should be in good condition and my shots keeping going downwards some shots will get close to my target but most will hit the stomach if I am aiming for the chest. iI it me that I can not shot good or the gun need adjusting. I mean my targets are about 15-20 feet maybe 25 feet that I have my targets not to far so I should be hitting close to the chest but the shots keep droping lower in the stomach or if I AIM for the head I will hit the chest. Please please help me maybe its me and not the gun or could it be that something is wrong with the gun and needs fixing
Thanks
Sterls18

You may be breaking your wrist.

[amstaffHK]

There are some other possibilities that have not been considered to explain his shots going low:

1) What type of ammo he is using - if his projectiles are about 500-700 grain and going about 250 fps at the muzzle then this would explain it - but the projectiles may be longer than the maximum OAL for 40S&W which would mean he is single loading them and possibly even dismantling the gun to insert each round in the chamber.

2) He shoots at a gun range located several thousand feet below sea level where the gravity is more intense.

Regards

Hardcalibres


Your not serious with those grain and fps stats are you? Looks backwards to me. but 230 gr. is common.